C. Diff sucessful recovery - Vanco + huge dosages of Probio

We spend a lot of time talking about the bad news in this discussion group - here's the spot for the good news. If you've had c-diff and are now well, please tell us about it here.
jimthomp
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Joined: Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:45 am

C. Diff sucessful recovery - Vanco + huge dosages of Probio

Postby jimthomp » Sun Dec 15, 2013 3:21 pm

Hi,

This entry is no about me, it's about my wife and her successful recovery to hopefully give other faith that in cases it can be beaten.

Approx 9 weeks ago my wife went to an urgent for a painful sinus infection. They prescribed the Cipro antibiotic. Within 3 days she was having bad cramps and diarrhea 20-30 times per day around the clock. She did immediately stop the Cipro and after 2 days of feeling horrible and not being able to eat, she went back to the same urgent care who prescribed the antibiotic Flagyl in a 10 day 1 per day dose and recommended an over the counter probiotic once a day. This was a mistake on two levels. 1: we should have gone to our primary care doc and 2: knowing what we know now, that wasn't nearly enough antibiotic or probiotic.

After the 10 day Flagyl protocol the C. Diff returned in 48 hours with a vengeance.

We then went to our primary physician who didn't seem to approve of the Flagyl protocol the urgent care provider prescribed. Instead she prescribed a 14 day protocol with the antibiotic Vancomyacin 4 x per day every 6 hours and then the VSL Probiotic 4x per day 2 hours after the Vancomyacin. The idea with this approach is that Vancomyacin is a very potent antibiotic that will kill everything in your gut, bad and good bacteria. The VSL 2 hours after allows the antibiotic to wear off and begin the replenishment of good bacteria.... but the C. Diff could possibly survive... the high bacteria dose VSL is supposed to not allow the C. Diff a fighting chance to gain ground and the good bacteria keeps the C. Diff a bay.

Within 36 hours my wife was mostly rid of the symptoms and by 72 hours was normal. She had to set alarms around the clock which was inconvenient but well worth it considering the outcome. My wife went on with the 14day protocol and as we approached the end we discussed how to provide further assurance that C. Diff would not return. On this site I found an entry from a person who took a lot of Probiotic post Antibiotic protocol. And by a lot I mean 20 capsules at a time of very strong probiotics like VSL2 which has 112 Billion bacteria per pill. I did some research and found that while VSL was good, Dr. Ohhira's probiotic had a broader spectrum of bacteria. So when my wife took the last Vancomyacin instead of 1 VSL 2 hours later she took 10 VSL and 5 Dr. Ohhira's and she did that 2 x per day for 3 days. She then backed off the huge dosage each day after by a few pills of each each day. It is now 3 weeks and there is no sign of return. She is still taking 1 VSL per day.

She has given up Diet Coke and sodas in general as they seem to be the only thing that bothered her. She may be ok now, but won’t take the chance.

While I am not a doctor and do not recommend this, it does seem like an ok approach as the key is to completely kill all bacteria and then quickly replace the good with an amount of good bacteria that will keep the C. Diff at bay. In my heart, I believe the key was the super potent Vancomyacin + the huge dosages of probiotic. Our Doc did not recommend the very high dosages of Probiotics post antibiotic. In fact she did not recommend that my wife stay on probiotics which is a puzzle to me. At any rate, knowing now how horrible this thing is, I wanted to share a success story. Perhaps this may help or encourage others.

Jim

Bobbie
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Re: C. Diff sucessful recovery - Vanco + huge dosages of Pro

Postby Bobbie » Sun Dec 15, 2013 4:15 pm

STANDARD INTRODUCTION: Welcome to the site. Read the first forum “All Users Read This First” and subtopics “Please Read before You Post” and “Guidelines for Posting to our Discussion Boards. (Note limit on posting length.) They will guide you in using the site and answer some frequent questions. Read Dr. Borody's article and topics in “CDI” – formerly” FAQ” – including “Hygiene” “Nutrition” and “Testing.” Also read The C. diff. Bible at http://apic.org/Resource_/EliminationGu ... fFinal.pdf.

The majority (about 80%) recover with one to two rounds of Flagyl or Vancocin. An unfortunate small percentage doesn’t and can suffer for months. Most eventually recover unless there are factors such as advanced age or other severe health problems. New treatments include fecal infusions and Dificid. Other drugs and treatments are in the pipeline, and there is increased recognition of C. diff.

If antibiotics contributed to your C. diff, be careful about taking them again. (See “CDI – Antibiotics”). Some people tolerate them; some develop C. diff again. (See Dr. Borody's article). Don’t take medications for C. diff. unless you are tested. (See “CDI – Tests.”)

For further information see http://www.peggymemorial.org and several other support groups on FB. Do research on medical sites such as “Mayo Clinic” and “Web MD.”

This is a support site not a medical site. We can’t give you medical advice but can tell you what worked for us and offer support. No one will understand what you are going through except someone who has/had this unpredictable disease. The best protection (for you and others) is thorough hand washing and good hygiene.

Although we know how devastating C. diff. can be - physically, mentally, and financially - it is not a fund-raising site. We rarely ban posters unless they are verbally abusive, combative or insulting; use inappropriate language consistently; or attempt to sell something through the site and usually issue a warning first.

Again, welcome. Remember, the odds are in your favor. (END)

We send the above letter to every new poster. You probably know most of it by now as you sound well versed on C. diff. You are a wonderful advocate and helpmate for your wife!

Probiotics help some and don't help others. I've used VSL3 several times when I had pneumonia and was on a z-pak and didn't get C. diff. altho. I am prone to it. (I was also on Vanco.) What "saved me?" I don't know. The Vanco and the probiotics might have "cured" her or she might have been in the "lucky 80%" of C. diff. sufferers who escape with just one or two rounds of treatment. One thing that does bother me is there no mention of a C. diff. test. Did either doctor order one?

You are correct when you said, "it does seem like an ok approach as the key is to completely kill all bacteria and then quickly replace the good with an amount of good bacteria that will keep the C. Diff at bay." That sums C. diff. up.

Thx. for posting. Congrats. on a successful ending. Be careful of antibiotics in the future although sometimes you have to have them. Ask for any test that would prove/not prove a bacterial infection. Sometimes a simple Waters View of the sinuses can determine infection.

Does your wife do saline irrigation. I had sinus problems for years - reason I finally got C. diff. Saline irrigation helps immensely. I do it twice a day. (I've also had 3 sinus surgeries.) It is listed in CDI - Infections.

Best to both of you.


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