Doctor, Doctor

Postby **administrator** » Wed Aug 15, 2001 7:22 pm

Chris User ID: 3236354 Jul 26th 11:25 AM [Experienced sufferers please excuse my review, I just intended to help make my question clear.] In order to wipe out C-diff, you have to hit it with Flagyl or Vancomycin. A byproduct is that you wipe out healthy intestinal residents as well. This is EXACTLY the situation that allowed the C-diff to takeover in the first place (antibiotics attacking some bad bacteria but hurting the good as well). Lactobacillus GG (Culturelle) has been shown to "out compete" C-diff for intestinal resources. S. boulardii may have the same result (no one on THIS website has said they noticed a difference, but Europeans seem to think it works). The American "infusion" technique adds a couple more good bacteria through by- passing the stomach with a tube and depositing them directly into the intestines. Dr. Borody's "fecal transplant" process takes the entire bacterial culture from one person and directly places it in another's lower intestine. Obviously, the theme here is "get as many good/healthy bacteria into the intestine as possible before C-diff takes over again." My 10 year old has gone through the first round of Vanco & still comes up positive for C-diff toxin. It would be nice if it weren't there, but I'm not upset ... yet. The C-diff spores were bound to germinate after the anti-biotic stopped. Whether C-diff takes over again is another issue. He's having more pain, but the stool consistancy is actually pretty good. Instead of relying L-GG, we're trying to get as many different healthy bacteria in him as possible. We're using L-GG, S-boulardii, plus some other Lactobacillus combinations. At the start, we doubled the L-GG dosage, but have backed off now. Has anyone tried something similar? The concern is that so many different bacteria/yeasts may interfere with each other, rather than just the C-diff. Cdiffhelp User ID: 2881154 Jul 27th 12:45 PM Hi Chris, You hit the "nail on the head". My wife Lori changed her lifestyle completely. This encompasses an entire diet change, mental and physical activity change. She also went to a good naturopathic doctor - who guided her in her diet change. We strongly believe that between the Vanco (under GI specialist supervision), the Culturelle and other supplements (under supervision of the Naturopath) and her own personal changes in diet, physical activity and a positive mental attitude - she kicked C-diff's ugly butt! I am in the process of setting up some way to get all the good, proven stuff available through our website - as many of you may not be in a large city where the helpful things may be available. I also want to get participation from Naturopathic Doctors to help guide our visitors in diet health. Lori's case history - posted on our main web site at <a href="http://www.cdiffsupport.com" target="_blank">www.cdiffsupport.com</a> - then click on the "Case Histories" link to the left. We posted exactly what she took and what she ate - all the things we believe worked are there. Bottom line - your message is spot on. Overcoming the bad bacteria is first and foremost. Between the yogurt, Culturelle, etc. I don't think you can go wrong. You should, however, only use any product as directed. And - keep in mind that taking antibiotics with a bacteria-helping supplement, will quite possibly contradict the supplement. You may want to at least not take a supplement at the same time as the antibiotic. Thanks, Sam and Lori Cdiffhelp Sue User ID: 2421434 Jul 27th 9:24 PM That would be great to get all the good stuff thru the website, I have a hard time getting the bakers yeast. Thanks for having this website. Chris User ID: 3236354 Jul 28th 1:23 PM Interesting. I read the NaturoPath's advice under "Lori's Treatment." Pretty much, wait for the probiotics until the end of antibiotics. I'm no naturopath, but I'd like to understand the reason. The antibiotic (vanco) operates like a nuclear bomb in the intestine & wipes everything out. As I see it, this would actually contribute to loose stools & discomfort because food won't be processed effectively (especially milk products which require lactobacillus). Clearly, probiotics are advisable once the antibiotic stops, but why not DURING antibiotics? If the antibiotics kill some of the probiotics, fine ... maybe SOME will survive to help digestion & start repopulating. Does anyone know if probiotics actually *INTERFERE* with antibiotics attack of C-diff??? Chris User ID: 3236354 Jul 28th 1:27 PM This is what's happening: use your own judgement: My 10 yr old is on his second regimen of vanco. Within 24 hrs, his pain & cramps stopped: it seems like it's working. If we DON'T give him Culturelle at the same time, his stools definitely get looser. I'd like to know if I'm interfering with the C-diff treatment. Bobbie User ID: 1069864 Jul 28th 4:03 PM Chris, Check the directions on the Culturelle box and the website Culturelle.com. All instructions say, "To be given concurrently with antibiotics." Of course, remember they are selling something. What does your son's doctor say? I suppose it's a judgment call. If your son seems better on the Culturelle, I'd use it, but that is my personal opinion, and I'm not in the medical field. Everyone is so different that it's hard to predict. C. diff. is a strange disease with "good" and "bad" days and even hours all lumped together. I found it's almost impossible to predict anything. The best thing I discovered was the "three-day" rule. "Don't panic unless there are three bad days in a row (or unless the symptoms suddenly become extremely severe)." My son was four when he had C. diff. the first time. He had two reoccurrences after the Vanco. was stopped and and then recovered after the third treatment. I hope it's the same for your son. Lauren User ID: 8771373 Jul 30th 8:30 AM My doctor recommended the Culturelle before, during and after antibiotics... Chris User ID: 3236354 Jul 30th 11:53 AM Thanks, Lauren. It seems to me there's a lot of experimentation with treatment, & I'm no exception. I wanted some reassurance that I wasn't making things worse. Cdiffhelp Administrator Jul 30th 11:32 PM Chris, I have to agree that there is a lot of experimentation. Unfortunately - that seems to be our job! Anyhoo... I think the Naturopath meant that it would be better to maybe take the Culturelle at different times of the day - not with the antibiotic. It is quite possible that the Culturelle probiotic critters may be killed if taken too closely to a dose of Vanco. Vanco does a heck of a job. Flagyl couldn't match it's effectiveness on my wife. The ND basically just wanted us to spread out the dosages. I highly doubt that the Culturelle would inhibit the Vanco. I think Lori was taking the Culturelle about 4 hours after a dose of Vanco. Culturelle and Vanco are not cheap. So, I think the idea was to maximize effectiveness by separating their dosage. Hope this clears things up. We have so many great visitors! But we want you all to get better so you don't have to be here! GET BETTER! Take care, Sam

Guest · Postby **Guest** » Tue Mar 19, 2002 3:24 pm

A friend sent me this, and I thought it was appropriate for this site. Subject: Doctor, Doctor Two doctors opened offices in a small town and put up a sign that read: "Dr. Smith and Dr. Jones: Psychiatry and Proctology." The town fathers were unhappy with the sign's wordage, so the doctors changed it to: "Hysterias and Posteriors." This was also unacceptable, so they changed the sign to: "Schizoids and Hemorrhoids." The town fathers cringed. The doctors tried: "Catatonics and High Colonics," but they got another thumbs down, so they tried: "Manic-depressives and Anal-retentives." Spurned again, they tried: "Minds and Behinds." Following another rejection they tried: "Analysis and Anal Cysts," "Nuts and Butts," "Freaks and Cheeks," and, "Loons and Moons." None received approval. Finally, they hit upon a winning combination. The doctors' sign now reads: "Dr. Smith and Dr. Jones: Odds and Ends." [Guest Posted by: 'Bobbie']

Guest · Postby **Guest** » Sat Sep 28, 2002 9:08 pm

i love it!! [Guest Posted by: 'marie']

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